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Wiring different interior LED light systems #732972
February 11th 2018 10:09 pm
February 11th 2018 10:09 pm
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 37
New Orleans, LA
VCVCSmiley Offline OP
newbie
VCVCSmiley  Offline OP
newbie
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 37
New Orleans, LA
Trying to wrap my head around wiring the interior lighting scheme. There will be overhead, under dash, doghouse, cabinet, etc LED lighting. For those who've run several systems, how did you do it? Auxiliary fuse box?

AdSense long
Re: Wiring different interior LED light systems [Re: VCVCSmiley] #732973
February 11th 2018 10:48 pm
February 11th 2018 10:48 pm
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 272
Tucson,Az.
H
Hasan Ben Sobar Offline
enthusiast
Hasan Ben Sobar  Offline
enthusiast
H
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 272
Tucson,Az.
Easier to just replace the standard bulbs in their receptacles with LED equivalents. My amp is going to be under the bed ,so I'll be running heavy lines back there and then in addition to the amp , I can power just about anything I want. Only thing is ,that they will be hot switched.

www.superbrightleds.com


Tucson-it's a dry heat...like an oven
Re: Wiring different interior LED light systems [Re: VCVCSmiley] #733001
February 12th 2018 6:18 pm
February 12th 2018 6:18 pm
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 53
Fairfax Virginia
StanVan Offline
journeyman
StanVan  Offline
journeyman
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 53
Fairfax Virginia
I can't think of a good reason to have them through the ign switch. Why would you want to need the key on to have lights?

The beauty of LEDs is they don't draw much current. If your van is old enough, there may be a tap on the factory fuse box that can suit your needs. I've run colored LEDs through a controller (for effects), and white LEDs for actually seeing stuff. I double switched the white so I could control it from the front seat of the back. I have also swapped out some of the factory incandescent's for LEDs. On the drawing board are a pair of bed side LEDs in mahogany shades, with dimmers. I also have plans for both white and colored on the underside of my running boards. The white may get tied in with the dome light when the doors open.

Last edited by StanVan; February 12th 2018 6:24 pm.

Einstein, when describing radio said "Wire telegraph is like a very long cat. You pull his tail in NY and he meows in LA. And radio works the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat."
Re: Wiring different interior LED light systems [Re: VCVCSmiley] #733052
February 14th 2018 1:46 pm
February 14th 2018 1:46 pm
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 603
Indiana
tuner4life Offline
addict
tuner4life  Offline
addict
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 603
Indiana
I'm going to be doing a big write up on this in a few months. Going to be doing a similar thing with a bunch of electrical accessories I'm adding to a basic cargo van. The LED accent/mood/etc lights will be controlled by switches in the overhead console. Those switches will run to a main relay box that is either at the back of the van, or more likely under the drivers seat. Also, on that relay box, each relay will have a switch that will determine whether or not the circuit is supplied from battery power or ignition power. That way if I determine that any feature isn't hooked up how I like, All I have to do is access the relay box and switch it.

I'm not an electronic guru by any stretch, so I personally won't be the one building this system, but I'll supply all the details as it is being built.


[Linked Image]
1985 Chevy G20 305ci/4spd Manual
Re: Wiring different interior LED light systems [Re: VCVCSmiley] #733079
February 15th 2018 1:31 am
February 15th 2018 1:31 am
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 6
Los Angeles, Ca,USA
O
Overdose Offline
stranger
Overdose  Offline
stranger
O
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 6
Los Angeles, Ca,USA
I'm also configuring the same , would like to learn more on deep cell rear storage batteries so if the lighting goes dim and voltage loss occurs, it wont drain the main ignition system . I also want to plan for some LED exterior lights for camping excursions.

Has anyone installed the trucker marker lights on the front cab and rear ? Are they run in a sequence with the wires on the exterior,... or is there a wire passthrough holes in the roof for each marker light?

Re: Wiring different interior LED light systems [Re: VCVCSmiley] #733112
February 15th 2018 10:17 pm
February 15th 2018 10:17 pm
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 145
Warrington, Pa
G
Greenstreak Offline
member
Greenstreak  Offline
member
G
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 145
Warrington, Pa
I just braced myself and drilled 15 holes in my roof for cab lights. Each has a wire pass through to complete the wiring in the cab.

Re: Wiring different interior LED light systems [Re: VCVCSmiley] #733196
February 17th 2018 11:17 pm
February 17th 2018 11:17 pm
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 53
Fairfax Virginia
StanVan Offline
journeyman
StanVan  Offline
journeyman
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 53
Fairfax Virginia
An auxiliary battery can be connected through a relay, one that looks like a starter solenoid, and can be found at RV dealers. When the ignition is on, the aux battery is connected and gets charged. And when the ign is off, the battery can be used and drained, and not affect the main battery. Here's a Google link;

https://www.google.com/search?sourc...-ab..0.18.1243...0j0i131k1.0.Oj9TmoZPGhM

The beauty of LEDs is they don't draw much current.


Einstein, when describing radio said "Wire telegraph is like a very long cat. You pull his tail in NY and he meows in LA. And radio works the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat."
Re: Wiring different interior LED light systems [Re: VCVCSmiley] #733204
February 18th 2018 2:03 pm
February 18th 2018 2:03 pm
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,584
San Diego
W
wrcsixeight Offline
veteran
wrcsixeight  Offline
veteran
W
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,584
San Diego
Do not goto an RV dealer for an isolating solenoid/relay for Aux battery, unless you like throwing away money and time for inferior products.

This is a very good one:

https://www.amazon.com/Cole-Hersee-...sr=8-5&keywords=cole+hersee+solenoid

These require a trigger circuit to activate. Ideally this circuit would only become live with after the engine runs. If it comes on with the key to run, then the AUX battery will provide some starting current to the engine battery, and the contacts in the solenoid will wear out faster.

Electronics hooked to Aux battery might not appreciate the surges when the starter is disengaged.

There are much cheaper Continuous duty solenoids available. Get one rated for at least 90 amps.

There are dozens of secondary battery isolation methods and products available. Avoid those with large finned heatsinks. Those heatsinks are for the diode which drops voltage and thus current, and greatly slows recharging of secondary battery greatly, and lead acid batteries ALWAYS, prefer to be fully charged. The diode based alternators insure full charge is impossible on the secondary battery due to too little electrical pressure.

BUt most vehicles voltage regulation is not concerned with proper recharging of depleted batteries, they are concerned with not overcharging, and as a resuly, proper battery charging is not only relegated to the back seat, it is dragged behind the vehicle. It takes no less than 3.5 hours to get an 80% charged battery to 100%, no matter how powerful the charging source. Those 3.5 hours assume voltages held in the mid 14's. No vehicle allows this. By all means use the alternator to charge batteries, but never assume it finishes the task of fully charging depleted batteries quickly. It cannot and does not 99% of the time.

A very simple method requiring no activation circuit is this product. When it sees battery charging voltages on starter battery then it parallels batteries.

https://www.amazon.com/Bussmann-RB-...mp;psc=1&refRID=R7HFXBVG13Y2M9KFCFFV

They sell bidirectional units too. These parallel batteries when either battery sees charging voltages. Avoid bi directional units when there are solar panels involved. The engine battery should never require any of the solar wattage, and some of that solar wattage will be consumed simply holding the electromagnets contacts together.

Re: Wiring different interior LED light systems [Re: VCVCSmiley] #733226
February 18th 2018 10:28 pm
February 18th 2018 10:28 pm
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 53
Fairfax Virginia
StanVan Offline
journeyman
StanVan  Offline
journeyman
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 53
Fairfax Virginia
Or, you could go to the Google link I provided and get one (also from Amazon) for about $15.00. And yes, it needs a "trigger", and a simple switched source (from the ignition key) does nicely. The problem with sensing devices is that they can (not will, but can) go bad and drain the battery. I prefer to rely on a more mechanical way to get power. And most switched power sources (except the coil and starter solenoid) deactivate when the starter is engaged. This is why your radio cuts out when you twist the key.

https://www.amazon.com/Stinger-SGP3...mp;psc=1&refRID=F3AXNPK13MS50B6KAXCT

The reason I mentioned an RV dealer was for a better way to describe the device. I know all too well that when you walk in to an RV or boat store, you'll pay at least twice as much.

Last edited by StanVan; February 18th 2018 10:35 pm.

Einstein, when describing radio said "Wire telegraph is like a very long cat. You pull his tail in NY and he meows in LA. And radio works the same way: you send signals here, they receive them there. The only difference is that there is no cat."
Re: Wiring different interior LED light systems [Re: VCVCSmiley] #733229
February 19th 2018 1:44 am
February 19th 2018 1:44 am
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,584
San Diego
W
wrcsixeight Offline
veteran
wrcsixeight  Offline
veteran
W
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,584
San Diego
These simple continuous duty solenoids/ relays/contactors also fail.

The more times they are switched on and off the more the contacts will wear. A circuit which triggers it when the key to on, then disengages it while cranking, and then reengages it after the key is returned to run, cycles it 2x as much as necessary, and once more than required, basically halving its lifespan before failure occurs.


The more amps they deliver into a well depleted battery, the faster the internal contacts will wear.

The most common failure mode of these, the contacts seize together, leading to NO battery isolation with engine off. They will still make the same noise as if operating correctly, but the failure is highly unlikely to be noticed by a casual user who is not looking to see if engine battery voltage also falls when Aux battery is being depleted.


Then the starting battery gets deep cycled with the Aux battery.

Since starting batteries do badly when deeply cycled, they will fail prematurely, and likely take the Aux battery with it too.

So then one needs to replace the Aux battery, Starter battery, and the Solenoid, and this became necessary, prematurely, because the solenoid's contacts seized in the closed position. The cheaper lower rated solenoid/relay/contactor/isolator could certainly be a false economy if/when this occurs.

The Cole Hersee 200 amp continuous duty solenoid I linked is not cheap, and could certainly be overkill, but it has the Silver tungsten contacts which will not only have less resistance, transferring more voltage, thus amperage to the depleted Aux battery, but are also much less likely to wear out and fail, and take out the starting battery through unintended cycling.



I use a 1/2/BOTH/OFF Manual switch rated at 350 amps continuous, when I use a secondary battery, but Since all my charging sources are optimized with adjustable voltage, and I know how much battery capacity I use, I get away with a single 90AH group 27 Northstar AGM battery and leave the switch on battery 2.

The NS battery is now 50+ months old with over 700 Deep cycles on it. Yes it is an Expensive AGM battery, but it has no issues accepting huge charge currents, and I do not require 930CCA, but it does not hurt either. When It was new, it was able to start my engine faster than 3 flooded marine group 27 batteries in parallel could.

As I type this it is 12.2v under a 7.4 amp load with 37Ah removed from it. My alternator at 2000 engine rpm can deliver over 90 amps into this battery when it is depleted to the 50% range or less. The maximum I have seen into this battery, is 112 amps at close to 3K rpm. I'd not be running an 80 amp solenoid, personally though I use batteries pretty hard, to the point they can accept these huge amperages for quite a while before the voltage at the battery terminals hits the maximum that I allow.

Some vehicles do have circuits which become live only after the engine starts. I found a badly oxidized unused spade connector hanging under my dashboard which only becomes live after the engine starts. I employ it to power my modified external voltage regulator. My 89 dodge's stock voltage regulator is internal to the engine computer. I tricked the engine computer into thinking it is still attached to the alternator with a resistor, and use an External adjustable voltage regulator to control my alternator.

I modified this VR with an external 10 turn potentiometer mounted on my dashboard, next to my digital voltmeters and ammeter, and can choose any voltage I want between 12.8 and 15.3v, but too long over 14.7v will trigger the check engine light.

Generally I choose 14.7v any time the battery is not fully charged, and 13.6v when it is, and adjust for battery temperature, more volts when cold less when hot.

About 1/3 the amps will flow into a depleted battery when 13.6v reaches battery terminals, compared to 14.7v.

I determine full charge by the amperage the AGM battery accepts at 14.7ish volts. When it tapers to 0.45A or less at 14.7v it can be considered fully charged, but with enough time amperage will taper to near Zero on this battery. 0.45amps is 0.5% of the battery capacity(20hr rating)

Flooded/wet batteries generally are full when they can accept no more than 1 to 2% of battery capacity, but those really curious can dip a temperature compensated hydrometer and see if the specific gravity in all the cells are all 1.275 or higher. The maximum specific gravity can vary from 1.260 to 1.310 among different battery brands in different intended climates, so having a baseline to compare it to on that specific battery when new and fully charged, is wise, if one cares about getting good longevity from a battery.

Getting good longevity is all about achieving a true full recharge as often as possible as soon as possible after each discharge. Achieving full charge is best done by bringing the battery to 14.4 to 14.7v and keeping it there until it accepts very little amperage.

While huge rechargeing amperages are not nearly as gentle on the battery as lesser amperages, it is harder on a battery to rest overnight at 75% charged than it is at 85% charged.

Lesser $$ AGM batteries generally say to limit chrging amps to 30% of capacity, but the higher $$ and quality AGMS like Lifeline, Odyssey and Northstar Benefit from as high a recharging amperage as can be delivered, keeping voltage below 14.7, when the batteries are regularly subjected to deep discharges.

Slightly depleted batteries are much mroe tolerant of less than Ideal charging currents, but once they are deeply discharged regularly, the charging current and its duration becomes much more important, unless one can afford to just throw money at new batteries or get them replaced under warranty, and this is not inconvenient or is found to be too immoral.

I'd hate to be a battery retailer.
What other product can be destroyed through ignorance and or abuse and replaced free of charge?

I drove my new car into a lake, gimme a new one.
I chronically overdischarged and then undercharged my battery, gimme a new one.

Same thing.

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