Vannin' Home
Posted By: Superbeast Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 11th 2010 7:47 pm
This is for questions concerns comments, etc.

Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 11th 2010 7:50 pm
I want to start off by saying as of right now one thing that should be made known to everyone is this will not be available to anyone except for me unless specifically approved by each person.

Meaning if John Doe wants Wookie's information, he must contact me and I will contact Wookie for approval of any information before I will give any information to John Doe.
Posted By: Uncle_Fester Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 11th 2010 8:02 pm
I am up for some sort of data base of vanners. . . . .
Posted By: Astro Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 11th 2010 8:10 pm
what do you need from me to help facilitate this?
Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 11th 2010 8:12 pm
I don't think anything Dave, unless you know of a software that may make doing such a thing easier for me.
Posted By: Astro Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 11th 2010 8:16 pm
I would have to look into it, I'm sure there is a way to have an online form that can be filled out and would add to a database. I have done it before, but the methods have changed so much since then, I need to relearn it.
Posted By: newkirkinc1 Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 11th 2010 11:36 pm
I'm up for that Ken.
Posted By: Westvan71 Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 12th 2010 2:02 am
The Vanner database would be a great idea, I'm in for that.
Posted By: smitty Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 12th 2010 1:11 pm
Sounds like a great idea!!
Posted By: quiet1 Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 12th 2010 2:10 pm
would the vanner year book that was done a few years back be a source for info?

Could a database or files be created to exist here with the vanning.com? And then create a few web pages to capture data?

Add the same to a laptop for at the vannin population, then have an upload script to place it in the db.

Creating the web page to capture field text is quick and easy... the question is the storage of info... and obtaining info back in a meaningful way.
Posted By: Suzie-BGfNY-IN Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 12th 2010 2:28 pm
A web app would be helpful--but again we must remember that all Vanners, even in 20/0 don't (guess you know my edit!) have computer access. Using the idea of a post card--they can be distributed in goodie bags and extras provided for those that are having issues making it out to eVANts due to health/family/financial issues.

I think this is a grand idea, I do have a fear that some will just not be willing to add their name to the list and I believe that would just be too bad. We are a part of not only Vanning history, but automotive history and as well.

Let me know what I can do to help Ken--get post cards, distribute, collect--POST!
hee hee
Posted By: Astro Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 12th 2010 3:35 pm
if we do anything online, it won't be visible to just anyone.

I'm looking at having options when you "register" where you can select how you would like your information shared, example;

  • share with anyone who asks
  • check with me first
  • share only with known vanners
  • don't share with anyone.


accessing the database would only be done by site admins.
I'm looking into different ways that it can be easily updated, etc.
Posted By: Virtual Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 12th 2010 4:12 pm
What exactly is the purpose of this database ? I think if that was clear it might help sell the idea. If someone wanted to inquire about a vanner in the database would they be going through only one person ?

To me the most important people who would need to be added to this database are the vanners we never see on the internet. This being said having someone talk about this at the CofC could go a long way to making this happen. This might also put some emphasis in finding out exactly how many active vanners there are in North America. That could help us with some of our expectations and when discussing vanning with the media. I'm guesstimating less than 5000 active vanners in North America which could shock some people.

Posted By: Wizard78 Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 12th 2010 5:25 pm
Sounds cool to me shift
Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 12th 2010 5:59 pm
Thanx for all the input!

Is that an offer Doug?

The main purpose for me is to have as complete a listing as possible of World Wide vanners.

The reason being, when people are talking and bring someone up, we will have a way to identify them, their van, club, etc.

Like Astro stated it needs to be done securely so that it doesn't get stolen and used for ill purposes. To have it on line would be great because it could be accessed by the authorities of the data base from nearly anywhere without having to have a printed copy.

John, the old year books can be used but all the information would have to be confirmed. As I recall too, the only thing in them was club and names with pictures.

Right now this is all research and planning, but if someone can bring it up at the CofC that would be great. I will gladly supply my email and phone info for anyone to contact me on this subject. This could also help get the word out to vanners that are not on line.
Posted By: Virtual Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 12th 2010 7:52 pm
Sorry Ken I won't be going to the CofC but it would be the ultimate place to get the ball rolling on this.
It sure would be nice to get some more feedback from the active vanners here though to help get the momentum going on this.
Posted By: HomeBrew Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 13th 2010 5:37 pm

Please keep the "CIA Triad" in mind:
Confidentiality… Integrity … Availability…

I have mixed feelings about this.

I see the potential for a lot of good…. I also see potential for badness. I'm a Security Practitioner by trade, maybe that makes me "paranoid" by design, lol......





Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 13th 2010 5:52 pm
Originally Posted by Virtual
Sorry Ken I won't be going to the CofC but it would be the ultimate place to get the ball rolling on this.
It sure would be nice to get some more feedback from the active vanners here though to help get the momentum going on this.


So anyone going to CofC that would like to spread the word?
Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 13th 2010 5:55 pm
Originally Posted by HomeBrew

Please keep the "CIA Triad" in mind:
Confidentiality… Integrity … Availability…

I have mixed feelings about this.

I see the potential for a lot of good…. I also see potential for badness. I'm a Security Practitioner by trade, maybe that makes me "paranoid" by design, lol......



No doubt buddy!

I'm envisioning this as being only available to me and a couple other administrators. I'm also thinking the only info to be dolled out would be by me at the consent of the vanner.

Right now it seems to be the general consensus that vanners don't want to share their information.




Posted By: Deb Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 13th 2010 7:46 pm
I think this is a great idea also.
It seems that I'm always collecting info on Vanners here in Michigan
that have passed on to add to the Vanner Memorial.
Especially the clubs here that don't get on-line.
Good luck Superbeast and let me know if I can help in anyway.
BTW I also like the idea of keeping it private; not being able to view
unless you are logged in.
Posted By: HomeBrew Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 13th 2010 9:56 pm


My initial thoughts…

I like the notion that an individual must authorize the release of his/her info to the requestor.

Wonder how/if we could verify the requestor really IS who he/she claims to be? Maybe that’s not necessary, I don t know. IMHO, if my info was requested, I’d evaluate authorizing the release (or not) based on who requested it. (That approach can problematic if I don’t know the requestor is in fact that person. )

OR

Let’s say I didn’t know who specifically I was looking for. Maybe they know me - maybe they don’t. What if I wanted to query for all known Vanners in Ohio, that are still alive and truck’n ? I’m throwing a party next week and want to invite all of them, but I’m not sure who that is….. so I do a search…

Wonder how that would work out? You’d have to parse our any info related to individuals that declined the request…

The down side of making the info not easily accessible to the general public is it does just that. At some level it inhibits the flow of data, depending where you sit that can be a good or bad.

At the end of the day everything is a compromise. It all boils down to the level of risk one is willing to accept. Maybe I’m reading to deep into this… LOL :-) If we dont allow "outsiders" into the community, there isnt much room for growth. I dunno, just thinking out loud...

As it stands I plan do to go to CoC. I have full intentions of booking the flight, car, and hotel this weekend. I’m not sure if I would be an appropriate spokesperson for this. If there is no one else, I could relay the message.
Posted By: Boot Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 14th 2010 5:47 am
Microsoft Excel can build a database that can be cross referenced by any field. Alphabetical, area code, or maybe you cant remember the person's name or location, you can reference by, say, Chevy van owners, etc. Any field at all. You can also go back later and find the date that someone was added. You can break it down by vanners added per month (which could be helpful for setting goals). It's virtually limitless, plus it converts very quickly to html format.


Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 14th 2010 3:17 pm
HomeBrew, some really good points and a lot more for me to think about. I'm not so sure I ever really meant for it to be a mailing list, but that's not a bad idea either. Sounds like it's going to be a lot more work than I originally thought.
Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 14th 2010 3:18 pm
Boot, can it have pictures incorporated to it also?
Posted By: Boot Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 14th 2010 5:57 pm
Originally Posted by Superbeast
Boot, can it have pictures incorporated to it also?



That would be something you'd incorporate when you load it to the web server, but Microsoft Publisher will help with that, and since it's all part of a package, Microsoft Office, they work well with each other.


I do think it's a huge undertaking, and you have a ton of work ahead of you.

Are you planning on making this database of only current vanners? If so, once it's done it'll be almost a full-time job to keep it up to date, as some leave and others come.
Good luck to you on this! I know if anyone can pull it off, you da man! cheers
Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 14th 2010 8:47 pm
I have office here, but I see I have a lot of learning to do.

I would love to have this as a past, present, future thing. I think it's all going to depend on the information that can be obtained.
Posted By: Astro Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 14th 2010 10:09 pm
if you have office, I can work on an access database, I too have some learning to do, but I have messed with it before. juggling a lot of thigns at the moment, but will help out as I can.
Posted By: ScarletteWidowDodge Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 16th 2010 2:26 am
I think this would be a great idea. This post is going to be a bit confusing as I have several ideas and no real order for them.
I really dont care who has my general info. I would be more worried about VINs and SS#. I think that we as vanners get alot of info and knowledge that could be shared and passed along to younger people. We have also lost a lot as can be proven by the whole thread regarding the old vans, where are they now. If it could help track those old vans and ones being built now that might help as well.
I have trouble when going to vanins, of knowing who is who. I feel kinda weird asking have you seen Roach, or Paintbrush or Animal. I tend to recognize the van before the person. Recognition might help.
The only problem I see is that many of the vanners at the three evants I have been to so far, are not on the internet. I think that the spirit of the vanner is not to trust organization and tracking.
Last point, I think that having contact info might help. I was thinking about vanner break-downs. If we knew where the closest ones were to call for assistance, that might help too. sorry for the mish mash of ideas.
Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 19th 2010 3:41 pm
All GREAT ideas Downie! Those are some of the exact reasons why I want this to happen.


Unfortunately (by response) it doesn't seem like there is a whole lot of interest. frown
Posted By: Doc 2% of Canada, EH!!!! Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 19th 2010 3:50 pm
As far as recognition goes at eVANt's, it would help if everyone posted their own pic in the avatar field, or at least in the signature.......

Even as long as we have been around Vanning, we are still not known by many of the relative newcomers.....

[Linked Image][Linked Image][Linked Image][Linked Image]
Posted By: josh_performanceinc Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 19th 2010 4:34 pm
Originally Posted by Doc 2% of Canada, EH!!!!
As far as recognition goes at eVANt's, it would help if everyone posted their own pic in the avatar field, or at least in the signature.......

Even as long as we have been around Vanning, we are still not known by many of the relative newcomers.....


Exactly why I put myself for my avatar "profile pic". After going to Keystone and recognizing Matchstick from his, I came home and did the same. I would likely have never made the connection otherwise! cool
Posted By: josh_performanceinc Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 19th 2010 5:03 pm
Originally Posted by Superbeast
All GREAT ideas Downie! Those are some of the exact reasons why I want this to happen. Unfortunately (by response) it doesn't seem like there is a whole lot of interest. frown


Sorry Ken. I haven't made it on lately! I like the idea. A database with searchable fields and a "profile" picture for recognition I think would be ideal. BUT fortunately, as was mentioned, a great deal of long-time vanners do not have (or want, or care, etc!) internet access. It will unfortunately be up to us regular users to track and update many (if not most) vanners' information. I often look at last activity date on here for people, but that doesn't mean that they've stopped vanning. I know a few people that just don't care for the site.

Given all that, is it a good idea? I think so! Is it a lot of work? Yes. Will it be used to its potential? Only time will tell. I don't think we can automatically expect it to work, but I could only hope it would not be a wasted effort. Let me know if there's anything I can do to help.

And I do suspect that the younger vanners are more computer savvy and may pick up on it more readily. Perhaps it will even gain us a few more interested youngsters if it is widely searchable. Then again, with our ugly mugs, maybe it will scare them off! lol

And more importantly, given this conversation, if it is of any interest, I know that Performance has been talking about a "Vanner Registry" for a couple years now. A suggestion was a "card" that linked you to the register, similar to like a "social security card of vanning". So, say if you're an East Coast'er and you make it to the West Coast, you'd get an easy welcome if they know you are not some schmoe off the street, and are truly the "real deal". There are a lot of people out there that are questionable and it sucks that we have to be so careful to not let unsavory people who are just looking for a party to get drunk and cause trouble spoil our good time. In these days it sucks we have to protect our way, and I'm sure that's what's causing the reluctance to invite new members. But we can always hope for improvement!

Damn that's a long post! Well, really if there's anything I can do to help with the database or if you'd like more about Performance's ideas, let me know.
Posted By: HomeBrew Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 20th 2010 9:57 pm
Originally Posted by downie519

Last point, I think that having contact info might help. I was thinking about vanner break-downs. If we knew where the closest ones were to call for assistance, that might help too.

Gee whiz. I never thought of that. Not many places keep parts for earlys in stock.....but I know some vanners that do. That would be really useful to know who you could call for he help.
That would also be great for long road trips…. Figure out who is in the travel path and what yards you could park in.

Originally Posted by joshvan

There are a lot of people out there that are questionable and it sucks that we have to be so careful to not let unsavory people who are just looking for a party to get drunk and cause trouble spoil our good time. In these days it sucks we have to protect our way, and I'm sure that's what's causing the reluctance to invite new members

I would have to agree with you. Sketchy people suck! But how do we sort the rejects from the people we would want around. It is a very ironic problem. IMHO, the trusting of “outsiders” has been and still is the leading contributing factor to the decline of the vanning movement over the last few decades. I get the impression that the community doesnt seem comfortable letting outsiders in, yet we sit around scratching our heads wondering why vanning nearly died out (Litterally). It is indeed a pickle….
I’ll be honest, new people that I don’t know sketch me out. : - )
Posted By: ScarletteWidowDodge Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 21st 2010 5:58 pm
Maybe a way to weed people out would be to have a probationary period or at least three or more evants?. Maybe the requierement that you actually drive a van and drive it to evants? I know that I had more fun at keystone and Summerset then at Freezeout because there were more puppies at Freezeout and the other two had an older attendence (no offense) And not that I didnt have fun at Freezeout, it was just louder and rowdier. But maybe the older people were just the same way when they started? Not sure what the point I am trying to make, but I know its there somewhere!
Posted By: LostSheep Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 21st 2010 7:24 pm
Oh Boy!.....Geezer Truck-ins! Geritol & Walkers Only! lol
Posted By: HomeBrew Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 22nd 2010 6:14 pm
"It was just louder and rowdier. But maybe the older people were just the same way when they started?"

Thats what I would like to believe :-)

Posted By: Tigerlady Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 24th 2010 11:28 pm
Originally Posted by downie519
Maybe a way to weed people out would be to have a probationary period or at least three or more evants?. Maybe the requierement that you actually drive a van and drive it to evants? I know that I had more fun at keystone and Summerset then at Freezeout because there were more puppies at Freezeout and the other two had an older attendence (no offense) And not that I didnt have fun at Freezeout, it was just louder and rowdier. But maybe the older people were just the same way when they started? Not sure what the point I am trying to make, but I know its there somewhere!
Well, actually, Freezeout only had maybe 4 puppies this year. Last year , I think it was more like 10 puppies. I think it was louder because we were all in Free Bird's big hootch and had the heater going and TV and DVD player going and of course, lots of partying going on. Even at Keystone, Free Bird's campsite always seemed to have a "full house" all week long or at Big Bob's place. Party goers go where the noise is. We did have alot of the younger generation there but alot of them are part of the Free Bird Club. I know that Wizard and I always have a great time no matter where we are. That's part of socializing. Yes I have to admit though, it did get crowded in there and loud in there but I guess that is just part of it. As long as everyone goes vanning, socializes and has a great time, that's all that matters. Hope to see you back at Freeze Out 2011 and let's hope it won't be as cold.
Posted By: heavy389 Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 25th 2010 12:06 am
Originally Posted by LostSheep
Oh Boy!.....Geezer Truck-ins! Geritol & Walkers Only! lol

What U say? wait leme turn up the hearin aid! shift opps LMAO
Posted By: starwars Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 28th 2010 12:19 pm
sounds like agrea idea ken but alt of work hard part would be for people keep you updated
Posted By: Doc 2% of Canada, EH!!!! Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 28th 2010 12:33 pm
Originally Posted by downie519

Last point, I think that having contact info might help. I was thinking about vanner break-downs. If we knew where the closest ones were to call for assistance, that might help too. sorry for the mish mash of ideas.


Like this one Downie ???

http://www.vannationalsboard.org/emergency%20contact%20vanners.pdf

Judith Pilon of the Natz board is putting that together for quite a while now....
Posted By: Wizard78 Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - January 28th 2010 10:14 pm
Originally Posted by Doc 2% of Canada, EH!!!!
Originally Posted by downie519

Last point, I think that having contact info might help. I was thinking about vanner break-downs. If we knew where the closest ones were to call for assistance, that might help too. sorry for the mish mash of ideas.


Like this one Downie ???

http://www.vannationalsboard.org/emergency%20contact%20vanners.pdf

Judith Pilon of the Natz board is putting that together for quite a while now....

That will work bow
Posted By: BudVanBeer1 Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - February 03rd 2010 2:04 am

Well, Ken,I applaud your efforts! This "VANNER Database" is a project that has been swirling around in my head for the past 5-6 years, if not longer. I had a vision in mind of how it should be but my lack of techno-prowess and a god-awful slooow computer have held me back.
A few uses for such a database I had are similar to some posted above such as the "Breakdown Assistance" idea and the "Need a Backyard to Park in for the Night" idea. I know some Vanners might not want someone at their home or yard if they don't know them. This database could put those Vanners at ease if they knew that the Vanner seeking the yard to park in was on the Database also. Vanners would have to be in the system in order to access any info.
I thought of a three-tiered system to vouch for Vanners that want to join the database, especially the "Newbies" (no offense intended), for instance: Let's say "Newbie Vanner" has met Matchstick (BlueGrass) at a few runs next summer, and through Matchstick he meets Stevevanner (Hoosier VC) and through them he meets Howard(MVL/Nats Board). These three could/might/might not vouch for the "Newbie" that wants to be included/have access to the database. In fact the voucher system could even be regionalized if the NATS BOARD reps would be willing to accept that duty. Just a thought and don't get your panties in bunch, kids, I just pulled your names out of my *** as an example.
OK I got a little long-winded I'll stop now. Let me know what you think of these ideas, and if I can help in any way, Ken, Please let me know.
Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - February 03rd 2010 2:05 pm
That's some good ideas too Buddy! I'll keep that all in mind also.

Thanks!
Posted By: ScarletteWidowDodge Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - March 07th 2010 5:14 pm
A "bump" here on this thread. I saw Docs posting on the Nats travellers aid and gave my info at Moonlites Snowball I am willing to put the info out there to help vanners so we dont have a repeat of what a few guys had last year, broke down and nobody stoppin to help.
Posted By: YUX Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - March 07th 2010 6:11 pm
I see they did not update this since C. of C's. I gave them my info and don't see it listed yet.
Posted By: billo Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - March 08th 2010 4:22 pm
Judith does that updating. Her computer blew up and is in for repair. So it will be a couple of weeks more before changes get added.
Posted By: Kekkonen Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - December 18th 2010 10:58 pm
A little late but an idea if you haven't already figured out something:)

The idea about making a vanner database is in several ways very good....but, have you thought about various laws of privacy in different countries?

There are different laws for privacy in almost every country in this world.

Just an idea....what if each van council made a database out of the members list from each club in each country or state...and all these databases were gathered to a main database?

If the council corresponding to the country it is operatinging the database in, it would also know wich laws of privacy to relate too:)
Posted By: Doc 2% of Canada, EH!!!! Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - December 19th 2010 12:58 am
The privacy laws won't apply as long as the individuals post the information themselves, or if they sign a release authorizing the release of the information...This should be fine under International law as well as most local jurisdictions....

It would be bad , and defeat the purpose of cooperation if material was posted without permission, which I doubt would be an issue here....
Posted By: Superbeast Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - December 20th 2010 3:13 pm
If and when this ever happens, I want to make the form (that each vanner fills out themselves) so that every item that is available needs to be approved by that person to be visible or only available by request and approval.

For instance:

Name: Ken Schwarz - Public
Address: 1234 Vanner Road - Private
Phone: (732)555-1234 - Approval

'Public' - Everyone can see
'Private' - Only available to Database Host
'Approval' - Available to anyone after request is sent to Ken Schwarz for approval to send to requester.

Posted By: dragonartlord Re: Vanner Database Reply Thread - July 26th 2012 2:04 am
I'm agreeable and think this is a great idea. As long as it is offered as a "fill-in-yourself template" then the person has already agreed to surrender any rights to Privacy" specific for the purpose of the data base. Let me know when it's up and running .
© Vannin' Community and Forums