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Re: think tranny took a chitt....
NateB #561532 May 10th 2012 11:11 pm
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Originally Posted by NatetheskateNCBV
I do have a copy of the 1979 FSM and to be honest it doesn't say anything about adjusting the linkage at wide open throttle.

Basically it says to make sure the engine is at temperature, open the throttle just to the curb idle notch on carb lever (make sure choke is open). Then from underneath the van loosen the adjusting screw and let the spring make the actual adjustment (the spring yours is missing at the moment Heavy). Note: Manual says to make sure the throttle valve lever stays all the way forward during the adjustment.


The "spring" he says was missing,is NOT the 1 on trans end of rod,that goes over end of threaded rod the washer(Cup) the nut screws on for adjusting,the leaver its self had small hole,in center of leaver(like a return spring would hook to,with nuttin hooke to the leaver it feels as if it is spring loaded?when U push on gas it goes back,at idle it should B alway forward,as U give gas it moves back...he is talkin about a re-turn spring on leaver to bell housing...will get some pics when I get it back,what he tells me is what Phoenix says,will ask more and see if he has internet access thier and show him this.... crazy
(the spring yours is missing at the moment Heavy)
The spring he says Im missin is just to make sure the leaver fully returns to forward position when you let up on gas....


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Re: think tranny took a chitt....
heavy389 #561544 May 10th 2012 11:53 pm
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What Reed, Phoenix & Nate said is correct. The scanned procedure works fine too, even though it's for a 6, it's the trans we're concerned with.

To reduce the misery level in this thread from huge amounts of retyping by everyone, I'll post my FSM scans. These are from an 81, and show the linkage in detail.

BTW, I've never seen a spring attached to the throttle lever arm like your Mechanic described. I don't see that it would hurt anything to install it. The function of returning the lever arm is normally performed by the spring on the carburetor link (a lost motion link) next to the carb. On a modified engine, like with a replacement intake manifold, those parts may no longer exist though, so there may be no choice but to use a spring on the throttle lever. The throttle valve *really* needs to return fully forwards as a starting point, or fluid will be routed incorrectly inside the transmission in relation to the throttle position, causing upshift and downshift speeds to be erroneous.

[Linked Image]

What Nate said about the adjustment procedure in the 79 manual not mentioning the rear position also applies to my 70-72 FSM. Apparently the slot in the slotted rod end they used on the throttle rod was milled to the correct length to match the stroke of the throttle lever.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Last edited by Ram4ever; May 11th 2012 12:15 am. Reason: Throttle linkage function excerpt

-It's been such a LONG TIME... BlueShift>> 1981 Dodge Ram B250 Custom Sportsman Maxi Van


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Re: think tranny took a chitt....
heavy389 #561556 May 11th 2012 1:52 am
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Yup. What Craig said. Thanks for posting those scans.


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Re: think tranny took a chitt....
Reed #561594 May 11th 2012 8:56 am
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Originally Posted by Reed
No, that is wrong. When I get back home I will scan you the right way to do it out of a FSM.


Why is this wrong then? Its the same thing as how everyone says to do it,other than nate sayin it says nuttin about opening throttle ??

And Ram,like I said in other post,the leaver feels as if it is spring loaded to return buy sumptin in throttle body,I did notice when it was outa van that the lever did not "fully" return to foward when ya let it go.....will have to see when I get it back.....mybe thats why he suggested the return spring.....Duno crazy


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79 B-200
Re: think tranny took a chitt....
heavy389 #561613 May 11th 2012 10:36 am
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It is the wrong way to adjust the factory linkage setup. If you read the factory procedure, it isn't "hold the carb open and make sure the trans lever is all the way back." The correct procedure is actually the exact opposite: "make sure the throttle is closed and the trans lever is all the way forward." However, if you are using a mixture of non-stock parts on the kickdown, then the factory correct adjustment procedure might no longer work.

As far as the lever returning forward, there is a spring inside the transmission that makes the lever return to its forward-most position. The spring up by the carb pulls the linkage back forward- that is why it is called a "return spring." The factory setup requires there to be a spring up by the carb so the weight of the kickdown linkage doesn't force the lever on the transmission back. Note that the service manual posted by Ram4ever calls the kickdown linkage the"throttle rod."

Also, unless you have converted to fuel injection, your van doesn't have a throttle body, it has a carburetor.

I am not sure what your transmission guy meant by the rod should just "drop in the hole." The kickdown linkage is connected to the kickdown lever on the transmission through a special block that attached to the arm and is adjustable. There is a bolt on the side of the block that you loosed so the block slides along the kickdown linkage to be adjusted. If I remember correctly, a long time ago (like mid-60s) Mopar used a kickdown system that didn't have the adjustment made at the transmission, but since at least the late 60s the "adjusting block" (for lack of a better term) has been used on 904s and 727s to adjust the kickdown at the transmission.


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Re: think tranny took a chitt....
heavy389 #561748 May 11th 2012 8:19 pm
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That big slot in the stock linkage makes the spring do the work. I have a Lokar cable setup and it is a positive front to back motion with out a big slot to take up the slack like my old silver '75 had. But principles are the same with the end results being equal. That's why I said what I said. Lokar tells you that you have to adjust your Throttle throw off your aftermarket carb to equal the throw of your kick down linkage attachment pin, so when you punch it tour throttle valve on your tranny is full open. I had to do some tweeking to get the ratios right but like I said the end goal is the same, Full off and full open between the tranny and carb. equal throws on each. I did e-mail Lokar several times while installing the linkage and cable. I will have close ups when I finally get going on the Tranny and shifter Swap thread again. Got stuck in the yard doing a bunch of dirt work and regrading and excavating , new concrete and Too much to mention now... TOO many irons in the fire. Big place and lots of upkeep.
And P.S .
I have the same drawings as you guys have posted in my manual from TCI and they did me no good at all as I have no stock linkage at all. And even if you change Carbs the linkage changes slightly. My edelbrock had the Chrysler piece and the throw was WAY different from the gas pedal to the throttle valve ratio. That was a night mare in my situation. BUT if you have all stock linkage just follow the setup routine and all will be fine. Just try tour kick down when it's all done and see if it stands up and screams like a Dodge should. Do a 30 mph kick down and see what it does. adjust the slotted linkage until it impresses you and then it's right. I will not be but a turn or two from a stock setting. That linkage is very sensitive, but very tweekable. Especially if you have a good valve body, like one of the old turbo valve bodies. adjusted right you can get rubber if you have it adjusted right on a thirty mph kickdown and it will hold it's position until you lift you foot a little then it will shift, nail it again and you are off againuntil you lift your foot again slightly and nail it again and you are now in high gear. That turbo valve body and a good shift kit (Fairbanks) and a 727 is the most fun tranny to drive of them all. I LOVE it

Last edited by Phoenix; May 11th 2012 8:29 pm.

Cheers!

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Re: think tranny took a chitt....
Phoenix #561771 May 11th 2012 9:13 pm
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Especially if you have a good valve body, like one of the old turbo valve bodies. adjusted right you can get rubber if you have it adjusted right on a thirty mph kickdown and it will hold it's position until you lift you foot a little then it will shift, nail it again and you are off againuntil you lift your foot again slightly and nail it again and you are now in high gear. That turbo valve body and a good shift kit (Fairbanks) and a 727 is the most fun tranny to drive of them all. I LOVE it

yeah yay lol

6 of 1 ,1/2dz of other.... rolleyes


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79 B-200
Re: think tranny took a chitt....
heavy389 #561833 May 11th 2012 11:14 pm
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Yes Reed..back in the 60's (like on the A-vans) the kickdown adjustment was made at the carb end of the rod.


Nate Breece
Re: think tranny took a chitt....
heavy389 #561865 May 12th 2012 9:03 am
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Yep, That's where my '75 adjuster was. It had all stock hardware. I still have the engine. the body is probably part of a Toyota by now smile


Cheers!

Been There, done that, Member of those....

Built for comfort not for speed angel....Well speed too !...smile

I am a vanner, Promise me the world, give me nothing, I'll be back ... next year !
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