Hey guys, was inspecting things on van on why the steering was loose. My steering wheel moves about 6 inches each way when the engine is off. It's really bad. I found out most of it is at the coupler near the steering box. I found some parts and my manual shows how to fix it. Here are the pictures of the parts and the diagram.
I got the repair kit off of rockauto for about 10 bucks after shipping. Looks pretty easy and I will include more pics when I get the parts and install.
I've had one of those fail too, though not 6" worth. Please take some pictures of what you find when you open it up! I've only seen inside one other one, which was on a website with a pictorial.
I bet it will help you quite a bit, but you might still want to check for any other things that are loose while you've gone to the trouble of having the shaft apart.
BTW, if you find a source for the little rubber boot that goes over the top of the coupler, I'd be *really* interested in locating one; mine's starting on the downhill slide with a few small cracks, and I don't want water & debris getting in the coupler and ruining it!
Clear skies!
-It's been such a LONG TIME... BlueShift>> 1981 Dodge Ram B250 Custom Sportsman Maxi Van
It's what you learn after you know it all, that counts...
Are you living to work, or working to live?
Learning from my own mistakes is good, learning from yours would be much better!
Ive done two befor and it helped but they will go again ,the part # for the dealer is #04443436ac Ive found that parts shops dont know what iam talking about Have been told its a dealer part ,some dealers still have these in stock as they were used till the mid 90s The other fix (but costs $ ) is to buy a flaming river http://www.flamingriver.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=218/prd218.htm there are a few other Co. aswell prices may be cheaper
Nick, I dealt with the sloppy coupler almost a year ago. My boot had disintegrated before I got my van, and I just let coupler continue to degrade. I had read somewhere on line how the rebuild only helps if the cup is not worn badly on the inside. I figured mine had to be badly worn so I spent about 10 times what you did and ordered the Flaming river U joint and replacement DD shaft.
I did not read the directions you posted, but if you have to lift the steering column a little to remove the coupler, do not forget to disconnect the battery first lest you release the smoke from something in the process.
While the U joint eliminated all slop on that part of the steering shaft, I was left with slop in the tilt steering column, and the reman steering gear, so do not expect a rack and pinion like performance improvement.
I would enjoy a pictoral of the road not taken. Good luck!
I just repaired my loose steering with this kit and i also fixed a leaky round seal on top of the gear box which i pried out replaced and all went well..but as always extra parts, like what are those two square cardboard looking things in the photo?
I didnt figure out the cardboard things either. I didn't do the repair yet cause I had trouble getting the tools in there to knock out those spring pins. I might have to remove the column. How did you do it?
i dont think those cardboard things is a part of the assembly..1st i removed the plastic over flow and windshield fluid bottles then i turned the steering wheel till i was able to position the roll pin slightly next to the radiator and that gave me enough room to knock the pin out..over all it was easy..however once you disassemble every thing, i found out that the steering shaft pin is very hard to knock out so i left the old one on there and stretched and slipped the rubber seal over it and it worked fine...also if you do this by your self it helps to tie the steering wheel to the windshield visor at the right angle, then it makes it easy to slip the shaft back on in the final step of assembly
My van has the same kind of play. I was underneath checking all the linkage and tie rod ends last night, and I didn't find any play down there. So I'm thinking it's either in the coupler or the power steering box itself. I do have tilt, so is there another universal joint in the tilt that wears out, too? My van has 101,000 miles and runs awesome.
Also, do you know if the Dorman kit from Rock Auto works for van equipped with tilt?
Thanks!
Last edited by AugieFromCleve; August 17th 2010 9:38 am.
I got tilt too. The kit is for the coupler so it won't matter either way. If you grab the coupler and can twist it or wiggle it back and fourth then you need the repair kit. good thing it's cheap! When I get around to doing mine I will takes lots of pics.
Thanks, Nick. I've spend the last two days (evenings) installing new u-joints (drastically reduced the "clunk" when shifting) and a new tailpipe. Now it's up to snuff mechanically except for the annoying steering. My wheel plays about 5-6 inches back and forth with the engine off, too. I'll be tearing into the coupler tonight to confirm/deny it's the source.
I had a guy cut the cup setup off of my 72 CJ-5 and after correct measurements and fittings, weld up the knuckle from a Chrysler mini van on my shaft, it slid right up on my steering box splines, talkin about tight steering.
That looks pretty. Where do I get the parts and how much? I been procrastinating to do my coupler repair cause I not exactly sure how to get my man hands in there and work. I thinking I will have to pull the column.
They say you do have to pull the column up a couple inches to get the coupler off the gear. Since I was not re using the original steering Shaft, I cut it in half and never unbolted the column from the floor.
Yea, I think I remember reading that. I think for right now I will use what I got and see how it works. How is that setup working so far?
I've done this
on every 4x4 I ever owned. It's far superior than any of the slip joints from the factory.
One word of caution, when doing any swap of this type or even fixing the factory joint, DO NOT try and skip the dropping of the column step. If you pry up on the column to try and get the shaft out you will break the crush pin (collapses in a front end crash to keep column from spearing you) and the column shaft will be junk.
Ken Schwarz Tricky Truckers, N.J. Van Clan Plus One, Canada Manse Vans, Finland Rebel Vanners, N.J. "USA" Toopa Sinner Tribe, N.C.
If you go through fixing this joint and the steering is still sloppy AND you have made sure everything else in the front end is good (like wrcsixeight did) You can adjust some slop out of your steering box.
How, you ask.....
On top (on the side on some vehicles) of the steering box there is a nut with a threaded stud sticking out of it. The threaded stud will have a tooled hole of some kind cut in the end of it. I've seen straight slots, Hex Head holes, Square holes and even some Torx holes.
I's always best to clean the whole box well before doing this, but at least clan the area around this well before starting.
Next take a BOX wrench that fits the nut and tool (that matches the hole in the threaded stud) and place the wrench on the nut and the other tool in the hole. Crack the Nut loose about 1/4 to 1/2 turn (holding the stud from moving with your other hand and tool) Now, turn the stud clockwise 1/4 turn and snug down the nut. Move the wheel back and forth a few times and see how it feels.
Repeat this process until the steering feels firm with between 1/2" to 1" play.
DO NOT make it too tight or you will increase friction inside the box and burn out the parts inside.
If you are doing this with a manual steering box it is always good practice to make sure the box is full with gear oil first. Some boxes have fill plugs, and some fill by removing this adjuster.
This is by no means a repair for a bad steering box, but it can buy you some more time in a box that is worn, but still usable.
Hope this helps someone.
Ken Schwarz Tricky Truckers, N.J. Van Clan Plus One, Canada Manse Vans, Finland Rebel Vanners, N.J. "USA" Toopa Sinner Tribe, N.C.
Yea, I think I remember reading that. I think for right now I will use what I got and see how it works. How is that setup working so far?
After I did the U joint, it was a joy to drive in comparison, but I did do the steering gear at the same time. If I did not remove the gear, I could not have slid the 10 inches of DD shaft back up into the column. I had the new one in place but unbolted, and just shifted it to the side for re installation.
I was told when adjusting the steering gear that one should turn the wheels all the way to left or right. Since the gear is more likely worn in the center, adjusting it when turned to the stops helps insure you do not overtighten it too much, as I did once many years ago.
[quote=nickrahn]I was told when adjusting the steering gear that one should turn the wheels all the way to left or right. Since the gear is more likely worn in the center, adjusting it when turned to the stops helps insure you do not overtighten it too much, as I did once many years ago.
Could be. I've only completely rebuilt 2 steering boxes in my time. I've adjusted dozens using this method and have never overtightened them doing 1/4 turns. Maybe running the wheels all the way to the stops will make the process a little faster by not having to do 1/4 turn at a time.
There were a lot of books in the 'old school'
Ken Schwarz Tricky Truckers, N.J. Van Clan Plus One, Canada Manse Vans, Finland Rebel Vanners, N.J. "USA" Toopa Sinner Tribe, N.C.
It wasn't my intention to contradict you Ken, I certainly don't have the to confidence to, or the experience of, rebuilding the steering gears.
The person who showed me how to adjust the box and told me about the wheel turning trick has been turning wrenches since before I was born and I thought I'd pass on his method.
He got nearly 3/4 turn on the first attempt, and it was nice in the middle, but too tight with the wheels turned, and would not self straighten after a turn, so he backed if off another 1/8 turn, and it remained that way until the gear was leaking so bad that I replaced it.
Thanks for your help over in my suspension thread.
No big deal buddy. I just meant, that maybe tuning the wheels to the stop may work too. Never tried it that way, but never heard that way either. Maybe it works both ways.
It's all good.
No problem, always glad to help out where I can.
Ken Schwarz Tricky Truckers, N.J. Van Clan Plus One, Canada Manse Vans, Finland Rebel Vanners, N.J. "USA" Toopa Sinner Tribe, N.C.
I was told when adjusting the steering gear that one should turn the wheels all the way to left or right. Since the gear is more likely worn in the center, adjusting it when turned to the stops helps insure you do not overtighten it too much, as I did once many years ago.
Adjust them in the center. I would assume this applies to most boxes, but Sag's are designed with a tighter center tolerance than at the locks (for the obvious reason). Adjusting while at one lock or the other might make it too tight on center and do damage.
All right, did some research last night and this is what I found. From what I can gather, my steering wheel play is ALL in the steering gearbox. All the linkage is tight underneath, and the steering shaft coupler checked out tight as can be. I noticed the power steering fluid was low, so I topped it off and then drove the van. That helped some, but there is still some wandering while trying to keep the van going straight down the road (although not as bad as before).
So now.....does anyone have a short description of how to adjust the play out of the steering gearbox? I'm going to search the threads here, and probably google it in the meantime, but if anyone can provide some specific tips, that wouldn't hurt!
Wow.....how did I miss that, Ken?? Man, sometimes I feel stupid!
I'll be trying this over the weekend. Do I make the adjustment with the engine running or not? I generally like to take things like this slow, so I'll be doing the 1/4 turn at a time and then driving the van to see how it feels.
Do it with the engine off. I usually put the front end on a floor jack too, but be careful not to get under anything if it's not steady. If you do jack it up, be extra careful to not over tighten it. The wheel will move a lot easier with no weight on the wheels.
Ken Schwarz Tricky Truckers, N.J. Van Clan Plus One, Canada Manse Vans, Finland Rebel Vanners, N.J. "USA" Toopa Sinner Tribe, N.C.
Wow, oh wow, did this help my steering immensely! Thanks for the great tips, Ken! I had to remove the washer fluid and coolant overflow bottles to get to the adjustment screw/nut, but it was so worth it. With no play in the coupler and linkage underneath, adjusting this took 98% of the play out!
Did my coupler the other day and my dad and brother helped. We got the things into the coupler wrong and the steering wheel is upside down. Now they gotta redo it to make it right. seems I might need a new steering box though. I got a few pics will try to post them later.
Heres some pics, you can see how bad the old pin was and how icky it was inside the coupler without the seal in place! Had trouble getting the new metal piece to stay put so we had to get creative.
Ouch!! What a mess inside that thing! One more suggestion, if you retain that Mopar coupling.........install a grease fitting in the bottom so you can ocassionally purge all that junk that wants to find its way inside. Like this:
Glad for the info and pics. My coupler has way too much play in it and the wander as well as over steer is as annoying as it is scary at times. Hoping to get at it in the next few days. Just finished a complete front end rebuild/overhaul in my 92 Dodge B250. Everything but the steering box was replaced, all of the tie rods. New upper arms, both lower ball joints, both idlers, etc. Then had it aligned. New heavy duty shocks on all 4 corners as well. Even the shop tech said the steering coupler was probably the culprit, but alignment was dead on. Hope the coupler rebuild will solve the issue. Let y'all know.
The only Stephentown on earth. I don't mind Coming to work, but that 8hr wait to go home is a bitch. No matter how little I do, I always feel I could do less. "The only thing wrong with a perfect drive to work is that you end up at work." NOVA VANS 1990 Dodge B150
The pot coupler needs to be serviced occasionally with a new grease fill. No one does it as part of any routine maintenance. When your steering gets sloppy on ANY RWD US Mopar built between 1963 and 1993, this needs to be looked at FIRST, because it is something that 99.7% of all Mopar owners ignore, until things get really scary. If that is good, the steering box adjustment procedure described about halfway through the thread needs to be checked. THEN, check alignment and such. There is a difference between "sloppy steering" and a front end that is out of alignment, needing ball joints or tie rod ends, etc.
As part of the replacement procedure, the steering column MUST be dropped and removed from the coupler before a full service can begin.
Van-free for a bit. WARNING: My posts may contain satire, wit, and/or sarcasm without warning! It's up to you to figure out which!
Thanks for all the info on this topic guys! Had very loose steering on a 1991 Dodge B350 with less than 100k miles.
After buying the steering coupler rebuild kit at Autozone for $8.00 and installing the new parts [well most of them] everything is working fine now.
Scooped out all of the old grease inside coupler and found some broken pieces [one shoe and 1/2 shoe spring] but not all of the pieces. Not sure where the other shoe and 1/2 of the shoe spring went - pushed out through seal?
Just glad I had some steering control after seeing those broken pieces.
Anyways without the info from this forum I am not sure I would have tackled this job or even known what to order.
SUNSHINE VANS-VAN DIEGO ADRENALIN BY THE GALLON & CHASIN RACIN ONE FOR THE DIRT & ONE FOR THE STREETS '93 CHEVY G30 454 4X4 SPORTVAN EXT 146" WB '92 CHEVY G30 454 BEAUVILLE EXT 146" WB
Can this column be cut back to near the gear linkage and reveal the DD section so the DD shaft can be inserted into the column as shown in the pics further down the page, or is there no DD section?
Any help appreciated as in the UK as it's not easy here to get another column ;)
SUNSHINE VANS-VAN DIEGO ADRENALIN BY THE GALLON & CHASIN RACIN ONE FOR THE DIRT & ONE FOR THE STREETS '93 CHEVY G30 454 4X4 SPORTVAN EXT 146" WB '92 CHEVY G30 454 BEAUVILLE EXT 146" WB
Greetings "wresixeight"...your photos were a big help...that's the first coupler that looks like my 85 Dodge B150 van..318 eng. could you tell me where to buy a u-joint like the one you replaced your pot coupler with? Your u-joint replacement looks way better than what the van was built with. From the parts stores, I keep getting a Dorman Part No. 425-253 for replacement, which looks to be for a "rag joint" flange type coupler...not like mine..I haven't removed mine yet, couldn't tell if the upper shaft needs to raise by removal or not yet...repairing anything in the lower steering shaft is new ground for me other than adjusting the lock nut on the allen head fitting on the gear box...that made big difference in taking out play in steering wheel, but it needs a full fix. Thanks for any leads. MonsoonKid
SUNSHINE VANS-VAN DIEGO ADRENALIN BY THE GALLON & CHASIN RACIN ONE FOR THE DIRT & ONE FOR THE STREETS '93 CHEVY G30 454 4X4 SPORTVAN EXT 146" WB '92 CHEVY G30 454 BEAUVILLE EXT 146" WB
I've just rebuilt my steering couple as I had about 6" of play each way when the engine was off. I found the little spring clip was broken up in there. But TBH with all the new parts and new grease I've not really noticed much difference. With the engine on the wheels move nearly instantly with the steering wheel but engine off there is still a lot of play.
Also those cardboard bits I guessed they was maybe extra shim/spacers where the shoes slot in as they were perfectly the right size.
So now I'll check all underneath before adjusting the steering box
Guys, I got the coupler off of the end of my Steering box on my 84 B150. How do you get the little "dowel pin" in the illustration out so the old shoes will slide out? Totally stuck here! Thanks
(1.5 hours later) Got it out with a wide punch and a creative upward hammer move to back it "out" of the hole gently without bending it because of the slight angle. jeeesh.
Now I see most of the play is in the worn out pin that is "stuck" in the steering shaft. Can't reuse or the whole mission is all-for-not.
Any creative ways to this Solid pin out? heat gun? torch? kryogenic spray? Beer? :-) Ok I put some liquid wrench on it, gonna let it soak overnight.
After a long battle with the pin, I finally used a ball joint puller to push the steering shaft shoe pin out. Just so happens the pin that holds the box on the steering shaft is undersized just enough to push the solid pin all the way through the shaft. it was really locked on omg. But glad I went the extra mile to replace this solid shaft pin. It was heavily gouged.
Got it all back together and the steering feels great. No need to replace the entire steering box, in my case. Joy.
Sparkyj, thanks for the update on your technique for extracting that pin, and congrats on such a clever and cost-effective fix!
If it's the pin I'm thinking of, I believe it was considered a permanent part of the lower steering shaft, like that little rubber bellows which (until it splits wide open...) keeps the dust and water out of the steering pot coupler on many vans. They weren't meant to be taken apart, but were to be replaced as an assembly. Could you imagine taking your steering column all the way apart just to replace that?
Great job bringing her back!
-It's been such a LONG TIME... BlueShift>> 1981 Dodge Ram B250 Custom Sportsman Maxi Van
It's what you learn after you know it all, that counts...
Are you living to work, or working to live?
Learning from my own mistakes is good, learning from yours would be much better!
Thanks for posting those photos from the manual. Helped a lot. I found the spring broken in coupler but not any noticeable wear on the keys and my pin actually looked better than the dorman replacement. Just changed the spring, keys and the seal as well as the dowel pin and was on my way. Took about an hour an a half and noticed a slight improvement. My van only has 52k miles so that probably why it was only a small improvement.
Would help to do this with a second set of hands for putting the steering column back in but not needed.
Before I start taking things apart... '83 B150 After removing the boot and small pin, does the steering shaft lift right out of the coupling body? If not, how do you get to the parts to replace them? Or am I overthinking it?
If I follow you, yes the end of the steering shaft slides right out of the coupler pot once the bellows plate is freed up - and you pull the steering column out. There are just little spring loaded blocks which slide lengthwise inside the coupler pot body. Depending on how dry and gummy the remaining grease is, the springs and blocks may drop away once you extract them.
Oh, and by the way, be careful when you unbolt the steering column to pull it back. There are usually a couple of little flat plastic "capsules" under the two bolts attaching the steering column to the bracket under the dash. They're very important, and probably no longer available. Support the steering column so it's weight doesn't shear them.
-It's been such a LONG TIME... BlueShift>> 1981 Dodge Ram B250 Custom Sportsman Maxi Van
It's what you learn after you know it all, that counts...
Are you living to work, or working to live?
Learning from my own mistakes is good, learning from yours would be much better!
SUNSHINE VANS-VAN DIEGO ADRENALIN BY THE GALLON & CHASIN RACIN ONE FOR THE DIRT & ONE FOR THE STREETS '93 CHEVY G30 454 4X4 SPORTVAN EXT 146" WB '92 CHEVY G30 454 BEAUVILLE EXT 146" WB
I feel like I could technically take the "pot" off completely with the guts and just put a U joint right from the intermediate shaft to the steering gear splines shaft. I think I'm going to bring it out to the Offroad shop by me and we can brainstorm a bit.
My B250 is my favorite. It sure is a handful in wind on a highway. lol. Park it on a dealer lot, they move the cars away! lol. Zach! good wrenching on going deep with the innovative repair. Dominate!
BBC Blue 1990 Chevy G30 L19 7.4 EXT Church Van, maternity division
DogVan 1988 Dodge B250 LA series 318 Wedge 5.2 TBI A500
Cabin Cruiser '94 Dodge B350 www.xplorermotorhome.com/ Xplorer MH model 230 230 hp LA series 360 Wedge MPI 5.9 A518 OD auto
glad i found this page, glad all you folks shared. where i am at: 1983 b250 with supposedly 137k miles. tiltwheel steering but i have 6-8 inches in play with engine off. Looked at tie rods and idler which all “seem” tight. so looked at coupler and that seems to have a bit of play…not all but some. since this is a tilt the rebuild kit wonʻt work (or will it?). i would prefer to just rebuild the coupler but if i cant then go with the universial u-joint from summit. i guess. thing is, all and i mean all of the pictures have disappeared from these pages.. any help you all are willing to give i will gladly accept. thanks in adqvance. right now it is a interresting experience to drive, so i really need to fix. not that it matters but the tires are 265/50/15 on front and 295/50/15 on rear. just replaced tires cause old tires were made in 1999, and yes they do come apart at that age. thing is tho, no abnormal wear, no sign of out of alingment, nothing. i was really hoping for tie rod ends or idler arms but i dont think so. i think this coupler and adjust the box and it will be as good as it can be. anyway, i await your help.
glad i found this page, glad all you folks shared. thing is, all and i mean all of the pictures have disappeared from these pages..frank
Photobucket screwed alot of people on alot of forums...
find who posted the pics U want and PM them
SUNSHINE VANS-VAN DIEGO ADRENALIN BY THE GALLON & CHASIN RACIN ONE FOR THE DIRT & ONE FOR THE STREETS '93 CHEVY G30 454 4X4 SPORTVAN EXT 146" WB '92 CHEVY G30 454 BEAUVILLE EXT 146" WB
glad i found this page, glad all you folks shared. where i am at: 1983 b250 with supposedly 137k miles. tiltwheel steering but i have 6-8 inches in play with engine off. Looked at tie rods and idler which all “seem” tight. so looked at coupler and that seems to have a bit of play…not all but some. since this is a tilt the rebuild kit wonʻt work (or will it?). i would prefer to just rebuild the coupler but if i cant then go with the universial u-joint from summit. i guess. thing is, all and i mean all of the pictures have disappeared from these pages.. any help you all are willing to give i will gladly accept. thanks in adqvance. right now it is a interresting experience to drive, so i really need to fix. not that it matters but the tires are 265/50/15 on front and 295/50/15 on rear. just replaced tires cause old tires were made in 1999, and yes they do come apart at that age. thing is tho, no abnormal wear, no sign of out of alingment, nothing. i was really hoping for tie rod ends or idler arms but i dont think so. i think this coupler and adjust the box and it will be as good as it can be. anyway, i await your help.
frank
Hey Frankie! Dogvan steering is loose too. To inspect steering linkage further, get the front end up off the ground. Grab a wheel and move it side to side, top and bottom too for wheel bearing play. Good wrenching!
BBC Blue 1990 Chevy G30 L19 7.4 EXT Church Van, maternity division
DogVan 1988 Dodge B250 LA series 318 Wedge 5.2 TBI A500
Cabin Cruiser '94 Dodge B350 www.xplorermotorhome.com/ Xplorer MH model 230 230 hp LA series 360 Wedge MPI 5.9 A518 OD auto
I still haven't had time to do anything with my van regarding this issue.
I really do not want to cut the steering shaft and find out the shaft in my van does not slide out to accommodate the DD shaft/ujoint and then be stuck buying a new column.
Last edited by Zach from NY; January 23rd 2024 11:01 am.